Space Command officials eliminate flight suit, jackets

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Space Command officials eliminate flight suit, jackets

Posted 4/16/2012

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4/16/2012 - PETERSON AIR FORCE BASE, Colo. (AFNS) -- Air Force Space Command officials announced April 13 that Airmen assigned to the command will cease wearing flight suits, the green flight jacket and the A-2 Leather Jacket by the end of the fiscal year.

Directed by Gen. William L. Shelton, the AFSPC commander, the move is designed to standardize uniform wear across Space Command in a resource-constrained environment. AFSPC officials stopped purchasing Flight Duty Uniforms, Desert Flight Duty Uniforms, A-2 Leather Jackets and associated patches for space operators March 14.

"We want to create synergy among all personnel across the command," Shelton said. "When personnel wear the same uniform, it has a unifying effect toward mission accomplishment. Standardization among the entire command prevents the perception of a 'haves' and 'have nots' situation; the very meaning of the word 'uniform' should drive us toward standardization."

This policy change was presented to AFSPC leadership from personnel within the command during an effort to identify command-wide efficiency opportunities. The policy affects approximately 1,800 Airmen in the Space Systems Operations and Space and Missile Operations career fields. It will save an estimated $670,000 per year during a time of fiscal constraint throughout the Air Force.

An AFSPC policy letter issued April 10 states that starting Oct. 1, military personnel in any Air Force Specialty Code assigned to an AFSPC unit will no longer be authorized to wear the flight suit and green flight jacket, unless they are engaged in flying operations, nor are they authorized to wear the A-2 Leather Jacket.

"Between the expense of purchasing these items and the fact that our operations don't involve flying, this recommendation was good common sense," Shelton said.

This policy only affects Airmen assigned to AFSPC.

(Courtesy of the AFSPC Public Affairs)

Comments

5/16/2012 3:45:46 PM ET
If wing commanders would take the time to read 36-2903 then people would not be wearing flight suits outside of actual flying duties. This changed back in 2005 and as of this date it still says the same. Since most Wing CC's are pilots then they turn the blind eye to the rules. To those that say its heritage read up again many of the first pilots wore the old brown uniform pantsshirt with their safety equipment over those. The uniform should be worn only during flight duties per 36-2903. The students at Maxweel are the largest offenders of this policy.

Lynn Whited, Maxwell AFB

5/15/2012 11:14:39 PM ET
And now they just need to take away the UAV pilots and sensor operators flight suits away...

K, VA

5/15/2012 3:24:46 PM ET
.... now if we could only go back to the old days when the Space Functional Badge was something you earned instead of the command handing out 'heritage' SpWings like jelly beans.

277, CO

5/15/2012 11:54:58 AM ET
What people dont realize is that the abus suck and the budget at Schriever AFB to keep the custodial budget going was 900000. This is for one base This is not a money saving issue. If it is lets just buy the uniform ourselves.

sparky, JSpOC

5/10/2012 11:09:12 AM ET
I donated all my old flight suits to the guys down at the local Chevron gas station after I got the news I wouldn't be wearing mine anymore. Man I tell you what those guys were real thankful and even gave me a coupon for a free oil change. Thanks guys

GH, Anchorage

5/3/2012 5:59:49 PM ET
This article is a bit misleading to some of the people posting comments.Missleers will still very much wear the flight suit.ICMB operators fall under Global Strike command wheras this decsion only affects Space Command.Flight Suits on missle operators aren't going anywhere for the time being as fire in the capsule is still a very real possibility and in some ways more likely than one in an aircraft.

CN, F.E. Warren

5/1/2012 11:36:46 PM ET
AFSPC should have Service Dress Mondays. Then the so called operators, 99 percent of whom HAVE NOT deployed to Iraq Afghanistan or other war zones, would see all of the support airmen who HAVE done so and all of the decorations for valor sacrifice the EOD Comm SFS CE etc, HAVE earned during multiple deployments. Nothing more inspiring than seeing an NCO or officer with multiple combat tours. As for the multiple BPZ Wpns School and SAASS Grads at AFSPC who HAVE NOT done so, well I am sure the AFSPC leadership will HAVE them ranked ahead of all else. The HAVE NOT support folks will NOT HAVE to tell their grandkids I spent the war in Colorado Springs in a cube.

Buckeye Warrior, Chesapeake VA

5/1/2012 5:37:33 PM ET
If wing commanders would take the time to read 36-2903 then people would not be wearing flight suits outside of actual flying duties. This changed back in 2005, and as of this date, it still says the same. Since most Wing CC's are pilots then they turn the blind eye to the rules. To those that say its heritage read up again many of the first pilots wore the old brown uniform pantsshirt with their safety equipment over those. The uniform should be worn only during flight duties per 36-2903.

Darren, Nebraska

5/1/2012 10:41:24 AM ET
I am glad that AFSPC is taking the lead in this and I hope that it will be an AF wide policy. If you are in the Air Force and do not Fly then why do you need a Flight Suit. Personally I've worn them in Afghanistan with the Marines and I can tell you that it is the most useless uniform for any kind of career field that doesn't sit in a cockpit for hours on end. Not that I am praising our USELESS ABU's however we should all be in the same uniforms. Sitting at a desk all day long should not permit you to wear a uniform that was designed for flight crews just because you think that you have some kind of right to wear them because it's a Heritage.

EOD NCO, Malmstrom AFB MT

4/30/2012 5:43:00 PM ET
Flight suit is a great uniform to wear and granted ive heard it all...pilots hate space guys cause they wear flight sutis...thats BS as they could care less guaranteed. The flight suit is a 1C6 heritage And lets be honest 600000 a year Everyone complains that we should be wearing flight suits but come one...its a money saving thing bottom line. And if that is the case let me use my clothing allowance to purchase my own as I will gladly do so. And in the grand scheme of things 600000year is chump change to the Air Force. This is the best money saving technique we could come up with

Adam, Vandenberg AFB

4/29/2012 9:21:04 AM ET
Please get your facts straight. Space operators and missileers get no incentives and officers get no uniform allowance just like every other AF member. The pilots are the only bag wearers getting an incentive.

Missileer, MT

4/25/2012 11:12:44 PM ET
I have no problem with aircrew missileers or even space operators wearing the flight suit or whatever they call it, but for crying out loud make them buy it. I buy ABUs and don't get any special pay...trust me, they can afford it with all their incentive pay.

Not a bag wearer, Monterey

4/25/2012 2:56:15 PM ET
What about the Flight medicine folks. They don't fly. We have SSgt's wearing a flight suit who takes care of paperwork.

Edward De Alejandro, NAS Pensacola

4/25/2012 11:54:45 AM ET
Hmmm so much hate for the flight suit. Alot of these comments about RPA pilots and sensor operators are INCORRECT. RPA Pilots recieve flight pay RPA sensor operators DO NOT. They recieve a special incentive pay that can go away real quick like if they get a nonflying job. This is not the case for pilots or other career enlisted aviators. Flights suits are worn by the crew when they are on flight orders. So if members aren't on flight orders on Mondays they wear Blues. Crews do not fly from a desk but a ground control station. One that if caught fire would burn real quick and hopefully the crew can get out fast enough...think race car trailer. Before you look assume and make judgements ask a RPA pilot or sensor operator. The planes don't fly themselves there is a person controlling it. This may be a new concept for some and it may help to come into the present century and quit living in the past. Last I always thought space controllers should wear spacesuits.

KJ, HAFB

4/25/2012 11:39:55 AM ET
As a former missileer space guy and an Army flier the flight suit is more of a perk than anything. I agree that its not a necessity. Quite honestly it is that way for a lot of bag wearers many named in the comments here. Not a lot of flash fires occurring in any of these environments. The bigger point is this who cares Focus on YOUR job and whatever it requires of you to include prescribed uniforms. The uniform obsession is absolutely nuts. If we were doing this right we could get back to one combat uniform shared amongst the services with our dress uniforms being the distinction. Even flight uniforms can look like the combat uniform. I had nomex 2 piece in my army days it looked just like the BDU. Uniforms are meant to serve a purpose functional or otherwise not to facilitate obsessive study groups surveys and never ending style changes. However if you get back to the missileer point I would have rather had some kind of coverall to protect my BDU or ABU at

Worn it all, Ohio

4/25/2012 2:28:58 AM ET
To the RPA Pilots so intense on their need to wear bags what would happen if you sat in that expensive chair in ABUs What would happen if there was a fire I guess you would walk outside and have somebody put it out for you if you weren't able. That sounds like what would happen in ANY shop or office around the AF. Flight suits like many have said are about safety and not pride.As for Missileers if they aren't wearing ANY uniform let alone the FDU they're issued what legitimate reason can they use to keep it If they can do their job in literal pajamas or sweats what is the point in paying for flight suitsWhen I was MX I wore ABUs because it was a utility uniform and I could get it dirty and used it for its purpose.Now that I'm a flyer I wear the FDU because I'd like to be as safe as possible if I happen to turn into a fireball some day. It's got nothing to do with pride or heritage for me considering I look great in any uniform. This is about common sense.

SrA V, ND

4/24/2012 7:31:13 PM ET
Hey 2cents if the ABU were meant for battlefield conditions then it would be worn in the battlefield. Instead the AF gives us different uniforms.

Sgt Whoever, deployed

4/24/2012 12:15:14 PM ET
Oh how I long for the days that being flight crew meant something in the Air Force. If you wore a FDU a flight Jacket or REAL flight wings it meant that you earned the right to wear them. They weren't handed out like candy. I have a question why do the new communications badges look like wings Real lightning bolts do not overlap in the shape of wings. Those who say the flight suit should be issued to all because it is a distinctive Air Force uniform I say you are part of the problem. If you want to wear the FDU change career fields and stop trying to diminish the accomplishment of those who earned the right to wear the FDU and REAL flight wings.

Retired Flight Engineer, Hurlburt Field

4/23/2012 3:21:53 PM ET
All I can say is It's about time Although I do miss the blue flight suits only because it represented the distinction of AFSPC. As far as I'm concerned if your butt doesn't leave the ground then ABU's it is That goes for ANYONE including RPA operators. The unique distinction of that flight suit should be left ot Pilots and Enlisted Air Crews only. There is a reason why they call it a FLIGHT suit Nuff said

MSgt USAFAFSPC, ALASKA

4/23/2012 3:04:02 PM ET
If you've never been on an actual military aircraft but you wear a flight suit.......that equals FAIL in my book. And that is the story of about 95 percent of the people in AFSPC. Good move Willie.

Jeff, Colorado

4/23/2012 1:02:04 PM ET
The flight suit is a piece of specialized piece of protective clothing and should be worn as such. If you are not in a cockpit you shouldn't be wearing it. That includes pilots who are at a desk. Put on the bag before you climb in the jet take it off when you are done just like firemen not wandering around the base in bunker gear SF doesn't wander around wearing their IBA and a multitude of others who only wear their protective uniform items when ACTUALLY engaged in the duty.

Sam Damewood, Holloman

4/23/2012 12:59:19 PM ET
Flight Suits are a means to protect you from heat and fire. Havent heard too many people catching on fire in the MODS at Schreiver when I was there. I now wear a flight suit as a Loadmaster. Makes more sense more now than ever. I like the guys idea that said to get rid of the Commanders GOV. Great idea.

BR, TX

4/23/2012 11:50:28 AM ET
To everyone that says flight suits should only be worn while flying because it was intended for flying only... well then you should be wearing blues everday because ABU's were meant for battlefield conditions not wearing around the office. Quit hating on the flight suits. You can always cross train... 2cents

2cents, 35k

4/22/2012 7:48:04 PM ET
No real issue with this decision. It makes sense to cut things like flight suits Guardian Challenge and other nice to haves in this fiscal environment. The sad thing is the resulting savings from this decision is a drop in a very large bucket compared to the 1.3T annual deficits the federal government is running. About one 2 millionth of the annual deficit to be exact.

Delphinus, CO

4/20/2012 4:48:51 PM ET
... Wait are they banning all A-2s or just not issuing anymore The A-2 is a piece of our heritage. It's a pride issue. It motivates people to do things they might not otherwise try. Having been a flyer I can tell you the effect is real.So keep the A-2 make it a personally procured item authorized based on current AFIs and grandfather those that have it.

Robert, DMAFB

4/20/2012 9:08:49 AM ET
YES 1 for the haves and have-nots comment. There is no reason for anyone not actively flying to be wearing a flight suit. Next lets call out these commanders who are wearing their flight suits while their personnel are in blues.

JB, USAF

4/19/2012 7:27:47 PM ET
When I was in Space command 6 years ago I could never figure out why the Airmen in the Mods at Schriever wore the flight suit. Our flight brought this up then but we never had a voice. Money speaks louder than Airmen. I later retrained and wear a flight suit now on C-130J Aircraft. The flight suit is worn for safety reasons not for prestige or a hierarchy differential. The space flight suit mentality should have ended with the removal of the blue flight suit years ago.

Brandon, TX

4/19/2012 6:58:14 PM ET
Great idea to derail the conversation and complain about RPA pilots. Guess what they're pilots and they're flying airplanes. Do you wear nomex when you fly commercially Should we take bags away from airlifters too Please stop.

Chris, Edwards

4/19/2012 11:13:10 AM ET
The real question is where are they going to put their flight cap?

nonflyer, NVA

4/19/2012 10:53:40 AM ET
Common Sense and savings could go a long way in USAF. Wear ABU's and flight suits when necessary not all the time. Blues should be standard for office time. GOVs don't need to sit outside every Group CC office. TDYs could be cut to necessary trips not to attend graduations. Promotion meetings could be handled online. Knock off all the privilages that create a two tiered officer corps and use some common sense when spending government money. Gen Shelton should be commended

RM, Colorado Springs

4/19/2012 10:06:51 AM ET
In the 15 years I have been in the Air Force, this will be the wisest cost saving measure I have witnessed. It makes sense for a flyer to wear his suit when on alert status and of course when flying, but what about the other days? Or the Airman does not fly? These items are very expensive and the suits lose the nomax quality after several washings, thus needing replacement at cost to the Air Force. The next step is to get this measure implemented Air Force wide. If a pilot is not flying today or is not on an alert status, dress like the rest of us in the uniform YOU paid for, not the tax payers The day of the flight suit being a status symbol for non-air crew personnel needs to end.

Paul Ward, Lackland AFB TX

4/19/2012 9:10:18 AM ET
Now if we could get the RPA community to do the same....

Cameron, Nellis AFB

4/19/2012 7:03:39 AM ET
Flight suit or not ALL the credit goes to Gen Shelton. He is a leader of the highest caliber and definitely not afraid to rattle cages where they need rattling the most. This is the same guy who refused to be pressured to change his testimony before Congress. The AF desperately needs leadership of his caliber.

BF, IN

4/19/2012 3:18:49 AM ET
@Joe Schmoe CO Really AFGSC crews need their threadbare bags because of the fire retardant aspects JD speaks the truth... its sweats and bunny slippers once changeover is complete. Are those sweats nomex as well History lesson missile combat crew uniforms thru 1989 were all cotton one and two-pieces then the poly blend two-piece. Then SAC issued the 100 percent polyester blue MCCU one-piece easily susceptible to cigarette burn holes when you flicked your ash out the car window. All of these had nothing to do with safety or fire retardance. When AFSPC went to the nomex flight suits in 2000 for both space and missile crews it was merely CSAF Ryan's attempt to standardize all operators not safety driven. Good luck

JAFSO, Saddle Rock CO

4/19/2012 1:17:21 AM ET
@LB The Rock I can't speak for the other career fields but if missileers are now wearing green bags then that would be the fourth uniform they have worn since the 1960s. White Coveralls Blue Utilities Blue Bags and now Green Bags. The flight suit is not a heritage uniform for those guys. If anything the blue utility uniform would be the heritage uniform since they wore it for 21 years.

GS, Retireeville

4/18/2012 7:07:21 PM ET
Having been assigned to AFPC and ACC its amusing to see the same arguments in both places. The once who wear the suits use words like heritage and tradition while the ones that dont use functionality cost and safety equipment. The fact is that each NOMEX suit costs roughly 120 and is bought and paid for by USAF. The average cost of a set of ABUs is about 90 paid for by the member. The only reasonable thing to do is to make RPA guys pay for the uniform themselves or have ABUs paid for by USAF. The reality is that ACC bosses are PILOTS which means that they will never take away the uniform that differentiates them from everyone else regardless of whether or not they perform actual flying duties. Welcome to the Air Force people.

idontwearabag, a base in Indian Springs NV

4/18/2012 5:43:45 PM ET
That's not a picture of F-35 weapons training. That's a picture of Top Hand operators - and one maintainer who knows who he is for the 576th Flight Test Squadron at Vandenberg AFB. They're in Global Strike testing Minuteman ICBMs so still technically not the correct picture for this article...

Ben, Vandenberg AFB

4/18/2012 5:02:25 PM ET
If flightsuits for missileers are justified by their use as PPE - which they are since they're purchased by the UNIT then no space operator or UAV pilot should need one. If that's the justification for missileers as we see below then it makes since...IF missileers wore the bag downstairs in a capsule. They dont. The blast door closes and the sweatpants and hoodies are put on. Whats the flammability of cotton I wonder...

Let's be real, Vandenberg AFB

4/18/2012 4:49:55 PM ET
Don't fall for the claim that this decision has anything to do with money. 500K in AFSPCs annual budget is pocket change. The real driver here is equality between operators and support personnel and doing away with haves and have nots. If it were really about the money they would give us the option of purchasing flight suits ourselves just like we are going to have to spend for additional ABUs.

Missile Guy, TX

4/18/2012 2:06:32 PM ET
I used to crew aircraft before transfering to space. Flight uniforms were basically designed as a safety-of-flight issue, meaning they protect flight crews from extreme fire injury. I have always thought sitting console in a satellite ops center about what could put me in a situation like that..i.e. an exploding printer maybe Tradition or not, carry from missles or not, flight gear belongs with those who REALLY fly. Now the real question is how many AFSPC folks have to rush to get ABU's put together

TSgt R, Schriever AFB CO

4/18/2012 1:24:16 PM ET
Having been a former enlisted aircrew member, I remember when I was retrained and moved to Peterson AFB...the first thing I noticed after removing the bag for ABUs was a bunch of non-aviators wearing bags. When questioned, I was told Space Operators fly satellites and hence the flight suits...Now six years later, I am glad to see some common sense being used by Gen Shelton...this issue has been addressed numerous times since Gen Lord created the Spwings and authorized the flight suit and no commander till Shelton wanted to address it. This is a move for uniformity across a MAJCOM and I for one am clapping Because as Gen Shelton pointed out in an email sent out here, it rids the Command of the Haves and Have nots...

Former Gunner, Peterson

4/18/2012 12:35:36 PM ET
TMM from ID, you are spot on. I worked for a few pilots in the latter years of my Air Force career and the ones I respected the most wore there ABUs and BDUs more than their flight suits. The made the decision to wear the uniform of the majority of people they were leading. So to all of those flight suit wearing future leaders of enlisted personnel, the first step to earning the respect of the enlisted force could be what you decide to put on in the morning.

Jay MSgt RET, San Antonio

4/18/2012 12:18:40 PM ET
For the old craniums out there, remember the Gen McPeak days and the flights suits with side zippers and epaulets. The intent was to wear blues to the squadron and then put the flight suit on as you stepped out to the jet. If needed, you could reach your blues pants pockets through the zippers. Good in theory, but terrible in practice as the blues would get trashed before the first fights on call. I guess we could be like the Army and just have a Nomex ABU for flight crews. Of course, I wouldn't look as cool.

Me, Here

4/18/2012 12:07:53 PM ET
To Lt Col Shannon Smith: Have you performed Missile operations? What is your expertise on possible fires in a launch control center that is buried deep underground? Missile operations being in a buried launch control center where the crew is expected to fight fires is different than space operations in a SOC I know...I did both jobs. So I would adivse you not to be giving a Lt Gen advice on who shouldn't be allowed to be wearing a flight suit in AFGSC, leave that to 20 AF.

Joe Schmoe, CO

4/18/2012 11:45:28 AM ET
@ JB in VA: What do I need to read an article about back taxes owed by US Military personnel for? To lump us all into that catagory is like saying ALL people from VA are idiots.

Still paying taxes, Not in VA

4/18/2012 11:07:17 AM ET
I never said individuals in the military don't pay taxes. I also said taxpayers don't mind fully funding all REQUIRED equipment and supplies for the military. But if you don't REQUIRE an expensive piece of equipment, how do you justify billing taxpayers for that amount? If you can do your job just as well in the normal Air Force uniform, why should an expensive uniform be provided? It sounds like a lot of the attitude from GSA has gotten into the Air Force as well. Hey, it isn't our money so let's just spend it.

US Taxpayer, Oklahoma

4/18/2012 10:48:36 AM ET
The real question is- Where is the 670000 going to be spent

RD, Moffett

4/18/2012 10:10:45 AM ET
Funniest thread I've read in a long time. To those citing the Navy's uniforms each has a specific purpose and is worn in line with execution of those duties. Their dress uniforms are their heritage. To the RPA guys who say -I'm a pilot that's why I wear it- flight suits are for a function not a demographic. To the - I'm tactical and blues don't work - Crowd flight suits are not a ground tactical uniform hence the flight part of the suit. And to the - I'm a tax payer too - crowd... go read that article from the news yesterday on all the back taxes owed by US military members

JB, VA

4/18/2012 3:12:46 AM ET
the person who wrote they buy their kids clothes at the Goodwill Store I can't buy into that. Our soldiers fight for us Why would anyone question buying their uniforms. My son bought his own when he signed up 1800 dollars worth and that was years ago.

judbug, home

4/17/2012 7:48:48 PM ET
US Taxpayer...guess what aviators pay taxes too. I'd like to think my taxes paid for my flight suits and my A2 jacket which I can wear with my blues as well on Monday. By the way try giving ground training at the airplane in blues on a Monday. That's a hoot. Real functional too. But try giving that as a reason for not wearing blues on Monday and you get great feedback. I don't know about other career fields but we're very physical in my flying squadron and BLUES 5 DAYS A WEEK DO NOT MAKE OPERATIONAL AND FUNCTIONAL SENSE. GET OVER IT. ABUs ok. BUT GET OVER THE BLUES KICK AT THE TACTICAL LEVEL FOR EVERY DAY USE. I lived through that phase already at USAFE and it was not practical and a mission hinderance. On another note the seasoned aviators wearing flight suits that are no longer on flight status but still retain their flight ratings...those are old flight suits that were from a previous assignment. You don't get them paid for unless you're in an active flying bille

IM ATAXPAYERTOO, LRAFB

4/17/2012 7:43:31 PM ET
@US Taxpayer we are all taxpayers. I see it every month in fine print on my LES. Wasting money in foreign aid and many other specifics of wasteful spending trumps any USAF uniform issuecost.

Active Duty Taxpayer, Ohio

4/17/2012 6:00:15 PM ET
Rotax not sure what hatred toward RPA crews you are referring to in this thread. There are a lot of service members and their families that are very greatful for what you and your RPA comrades do on a daily basis. Just because they question your wear of the flight suit while doing it doesn't mean they value your contribution any less.Keep up the great ISR work. Eyes on.

CMSgt Timothy Servati, Holloman AFB NM

4/17/2012 5:20:50 PM ET
Finally some of the people who don't need flight suits won't be wearing them. I long for the day when RPA people have the same fate. If you don't fly you don't need a flight suit. It seems like the majority of non-flying flight suit wearers feel that they need to wear one must make them feel more validated.

Actual Flyer, Cannon AFB NM

4/17/2012 4:57:26 PM ET
about time. flight suits are about safety not status. if your not flying you don't need one.

gabe, moody

4/17/2012 4:38:12 PM ET
PA pilots and sensors are in command of an aircraft. Thus they were flightsuits. That's how it is and that's how it will be. They are PICs...check the -1 and associated regs.To beancounters it's all about nomex and safety. To butt-hurt F-16 drivers who do nothing but airshows it's about actually being in the ac. RPA crews are fighting the war now 247 and saving our boots on the ground. They work around the clock providing overwatch...they can wear whatever the hell they want.

Matt, United States

4/17/2012 4:18:40 PM ET
@Retired Ohio I'll take your bet and raise you 2 leather A2 jackets. LOL

Retired, Colorado

4/17/2012 4:18:12 PM ET
To US Taxpayer Why do I wear a flt suit in RPAs that's the correct term for UAV or UAS now Because the AF says I can. If the AF tells me to stop I will. I will still get my status from the pilot wings on my chest. As far as who pays for them I would gladly buy my own flt suits if I could because my two 12 yr old flt suits are starting to wear out. The two 6 yr old ones are still doing well. Finally got 2 new ones today. To all the other RPA haters out there. Why do I wear wings and get flight pay. Because I'm a PILOT yeap that's right I went to PILOT training and I earned my PILOT wings. I get flight pay becuase there is high demand for RPA pilots in the civilian market and the AF is having a hard time keeping us in the military.

Stork, Holloman

4/17/2012 4:17:37 PM ET
While this decision does make sense I continually read about how the USAF has no heritage or traditions and the leadership keeps changing uniforms to ensure that. While getting rid of the bags worn by non-flyers makes sense it's part of AF tradition and heritage that our aircres missiliers and space ops guysgals have worn them. I could care less either way but I find it interesting that those complaining on this thread are injecting quite a bit of emotion and are typically the ones I see ranting about the USAF having no heritage or traditions. Would you all prefer we bring back the blue tiger striped BDU we field tested

LB, The Rock

4/17/2012 4:03:54 PM ET
I fully agree with US Taxpayer and others below in terms of funding stream. However instead of killing heritage for aircrew why not provide a reasonable allowance of flight suits when on flying status say 2 when you show up to UPT and up to 1 per year for wear as needed in a flying unit. Then have flight suits and leather jackets available at clothing sales but only authorize them for certain AFSCs. If RPA not deployed and launching aircraft want to wear them they can buy them. Probably still makes sense to issue them to deployed RPA pilots and missileers though as they are in environments where Nomex might come in handy.

Middle Ground, VA

4/17/2012 4:03:52 PM ET
I for one feel that it should be flights suits for everybody and all AFSCs. No more ABUs or Blues just the flight suit so we can all fly fight and win... like a UAV operator 3 feet AGL.

D, MDL

4/17/2012 4:00:04 PM ET
This is a directive that is long overdue This should be adopted across the Air Force. Makes sense

Retired Chief, Maxwell

4/17/2012 3:55:48 PM ET
As a former missileer I can say the special missile uniform isn't actually worn while on duty in the capsule anyway. As soon as the blast door closes the sweats are put on. So just get rid of the missile uniforms too.

JD, Oklahoma

4/17/2012 3:41:28 PM ET
Dear US Taxpayer in OK while your point that these members duties do not require the extra expense of a flight suit you make sweeping claims that these expenses are coming from your paycheck in the form of taxes and not ours. All service members pay federal income tax just like the civilian population so we are just as burdened by these extraneous expenses as you. In some ways it could be said that we are more burdened because we are in fact funding our own salery and equipment.

JL, Kirtland AFB

4/17/2012 3:34:16 PM ET
The new policy is absolutely out of touch with what his professionals want. Professionals wearing this uniform in AFSPC fly as much as RPA operators in ACC and the staff pilots in all Commands. Did the General's think tank ponder making the Space and Missile professionals purchaseupkeep their own since ostensibly this is another decision made based on availability funds and NOT historylegacy. Let's also get away from the Missile desinator again that'll save a few dollars for a Commander's conference or perhaps another enlisted Aide...

one more sheep, Maxwell AFB

4/17/2012 3:23:58 PM ET
Now lets get rid of GOVs. Why should all airmen have to drive their POVs everywhere they go while the brass get a car provided to them. Sure would eliminate unofficial use of a GOV and save alot of money.

dg, AZ

4/17/2012 3:09:39 PM ET
@ US Taxpayer..I feel the need to clear something up based on your post because I have the impression you think we DO NOT pay taxes. I have been on AD for the last 20 years and have paid taxes since day one. Please don't think for a mintue the men and women in uniform aren't taxpayers as well...because we are

Taxpayer as well, USA

4/17/2012 2:40:20 PM ET
Navy and Marine personnel wear several uniforms and there are no complaints there. People who complain about space operators wearing flight suits do not know the tradition. Space and Missile operators wore the blue flight suits and were switched to the green flight suits in order to save money. It would be nice to see the Air Force support heritage for a change. The service should go back to the blue flight suits for Space and Missile operators. As for the budget most of the money is being wasted in acquisition process. The air force spends way too much on items they procure. Its time for the Air Force to stop over paying for products that do not work as advertised and find the best product for the best price.

RJ, CA

4/17/2012 2:35:28 PM ET
How about Service Dress all day every day And business suits for the civilians and contractors while we're at it. Time for mor discipline in the USAF...we can't afford becoming the next GSA

Joe, WPAFB OH

4/17/2012 2:13:41 PM ET
A fiscally sound decision This an example of BOLD leadership. The AF needs to rein itself in when it comes to uniform spending and this was a step in the right direction. You have Space Command in flight suits drone operators in flight suits and civilian AFRC technicians wearing ABUs all on the taxpayer's dime. Hopefully more leaders will step up to clip the BIG waste like this that goes on right under their noses.

Deja Vu, AF

4/17/2012 1:47:18 PM ET
Very long overdue. At the same time this standardization should apply everywhere. We tell our Airmen that unless their duties require them to wear the utility uniform then they must wear blues on Mondays. But what do we see Leadership at all levels wearing ABUs or flight suits instead. For the same reason we wear blues on Mondays Wing leadership should wear ABUs on Tuesday through Friday if not flying.

TMM, ID

4/17/2012 1:15:26 PM ET
Am I the only one confused by the article talking about AFSPC revoking flight suit wear associated with a picture of F-35 Weapons Training

GH, Nellis

4/17/2012 1:14:57 PM ET
Anyone who has been in space more than 15 minutes remembers that the FDU was the replacement for the SMCU around 2000. Those with little or no space background just rely on their one liner about not being satellite pilots. But AFSPC is odd that way. Well stop issuing FDUs to operators to save money in the ever popular and clich world of budgetary constraints but well move an entire unit half way across the nation to bolster operational synergy. I wonder how long that cost would have funded FDU procurement.

Bubba, Colorado

4/17/2012 1:08:23 PM ET
Inside info says RPA operators WILL be next to lose their flight suits. The Nomex flight suit's fire resistant and low-static properties designates it as PPE for flying air crews due to the fire risk posed by aviation fuel during a mishap. There is no such risk for an RPA operator sitting at a desk console.

Breeze, DC

4/17/2012 12:48:03 PM ET
To Reaper and everyone else who is wearing a uniform provided by MY tax money. If you don't REQUIRE it for your job what is the justification I don't mind buying military required equipment and supplies but why should MY money not YOUR money be used to provide YOU with a very expensive piece of clothing that gives YOU some kind of STATUS and I buy my kids school clothes at Goodwill

US Taxpayer, Oklahoma

4/17/2012 12:48:01 PM ET
Despite the Pilot shortage there are overwhelming more pilots 'flying' a desk then a plane. If you want to save money and standardize the uniform then go the way of the Marines - you only wear a flight suit when you will actually be performing flight duties during the duty day...period Will this move save money...sure but 670K is behind the decimal point and from a budget perspective hardly worth talking about...this is politics pure and simple.

AD, Pentagon

4/17/2012 12:01:59 PM ET
So many people disproving your own point. If you're not in a plane you don't need it. It's purpose is not career field identity or morale... it's nomex i.e. fire retardant i.e. safety. No need for it in an RPA seat no need for it flying a satellite no need for it flying a desk. Your uniforms are a source of pride not a burden wear your blues or ABUs wear them with pride and stop whining. 4-5 day a week blues are coming for about 90 percent of us get ready.

JB, VA

4/17/2012 11:34:53 AM ET
Great move by General Shelton. This is the type of leadership the Air Force needs--tough leaders who are not afraid to break down paradigms and ignore the pervasive That's the way it's always been mentality that keeps real progress from being made. Let's see if the Global StrikeCC follows suit and eliminates flight suits and special jackets for missileers. That would save a substantially greater amount of money. There is absolutely zero justification for missileers to remain in flight suits. Make them wear ABU's like all their fellow ground Airmen.

Lt Col Shannon Smith, Maxwell AFB AL

4/17/2012 10:56:45 AM ET
WOW good on you general makes perfect sense. now all we gotta do is get the RPA guys in on this.

PR, nevada

4/17/2012 10:55:40 AM ET
While we are at it let's get rid of blues Monday and we can all be in the same uniform and look like a team. Instead we have half the base in one uniform and the other half in another.

Me, Your Base

4/17/2012 10:29:12 AM ET
It should be effective Air Force wide. Why don't thye reserve the flight suit for when one is flying it would save a lot of money spent on flight suiit since the Air Force purchases them for the members. You have enlisted maintenance that have to buy their own uniforms and when they get messed up.

Cyrus, Davis-Monthan

4/17/2012 9:55:19 AM ET
Why did it take a time of fiscal constraint throughout the Air Force to initiate good common sense

Retired Airman, Virginia

4/17/2012 9:20:55 AM ET
Officers wear flight suits all the time at Hanscom AFB MA and the only planes they have are on pedestals. I'm an officer and a pilot so I can wear my flight suit anytime I want to

DB, Albuquerque

4/17/2012 9:20:40 AM ET
RPA pilots are at the controls of an actual aircraft thus they wear the suit. Get over it. It's not about PPE and it rarely is...if it is then why to aircrew where them after they no longer fly

Reaper, NV

4/17/2012 8:34:47 AM ET
I will wager 5 Flight Suits that once Gen Shelton retires or moves on this policy will be reversed by the next man in charge.

Retired, Ohio

4/17/2012 7:57:10 AM ET
Long overdue Funny we also continue to pay enlisted space and sensor operators annual clothing allowance as well. AF leaders your next move is to stop paying Remotely Piloted Aircraft pilots and sensor operators flight pay and get them out of flight suits as well. They don't fly

Chief K Ret, SA Texas

4/17/2012 7:32:36 AM ET
Two Thumbs up for the ChiefGood We need more DOD sponsored waste savings so the pinheads at the top will keep their mitts off our hard earned TRICARE benefits CMSgt Ron Sliga-retired Biloxi

TC, NJ

4/17/2012 7:11:14 AM ET
This is great news. I applaud leadership for this decision.

CGO, Peterson AFB

4/16/2012 11:45:04 PM ET
A STO receives the Air Force Cross and the story receives 4 comments. Space Command cancels flight suits and the story receives 15 comments. Our priorities are severely skewed.

Mike, NC

4/16/2012 10:04:22 PM ET
670k in savings sweet That almost pays for the GSA boondoggle in Vegas

BS, KS

4/16/2012 9:32:41 PM ET
All this hate towards RPA crews is just ignorance. We are aircrew on flight orders just like any other pilot or CEA. It's like telling MX they can't wear ABUs because they are just mechanics.

Rotax, Creech AFB

4/16/2012 9:22:44 PM ET
These are significant cost savings. How can we possibly justify putting folks in flight suits when we are cutting military personnel and laying off civilian employees. Many kudos to the person who made the decision to do this. Much more needs to be done.

DP, NAS Whiting

4/16/2012 9:08:59 PM ET
Why does any aircrew member wear a leather jacket There hasn't been a functional need since WWII. What a waste of moneyresources Even funniersick when you see the majority of aircrews flying a desk.

why, CONUS

4/16/2012 7:46:21 PM ET
Great move. Should be USAF-wide

Mike Waters - PAO, Fayetteville NY

4/16/2012 5:53:01 PM ET
Keyword here...Flight Suit. If you are not performing Flight related duties then you have no business wearing or purchasing flight gear PERIOD Kudos on the Gen. for realizing the need for the Space community to wear ABU's like every other non-flying Airman. Probably one of the best decisions that have been made in years.

Staff Sgt., Nellis AFB Nev.

4/16/2012 5:45:21 PM ET
Wow I've been in the AF 21 years and this has all ways been a point of contention how much we'd save if we stopped buying flight suits and jackets for people that don't fly. Hopefully they can push this for people who's duties don't include flying permanently. As in grounded and will only see the inside of an aircraft as a passenger ... plenty of those around too

About Time, Hill AFB

4/16/2012 4:40:31 PM ET
@DFJ....the flight duty uniform is authorized for certain AFSC'S when not flying. But I agree Space Command does not need them.

Wow, Staffnot flying

4/16/2012 4:24:50 PM ET
AFGSC needs to follow AFSPC's lead.

JR, WY

4/16/2012 4:16:09 PM ET
Good We need more DOD sponsored waste savings so the pinheads at the top will keep their mitts off our hard earned TRICARE benefits

CMSgt Ron Sliga-retired, Biloxi

4/16/2012 3:18:47 PM ET
Why did it take a time of fiscal constraint for good common sense to prevail

Retired Airman, VA

4/16/2012 1:55:36 PM ET
Since the flight suit is safety gear and is issued for free as PPE it should not be worn by anyone unless they are about to fly. This may be a small savings but enough drops in the bucket fills the bucket.

Paul, Hanscom

4/16/2012 1:47:13 PM ET
Don't look now but finally a decision that makes perfect sense

Amazed, USA

4/16/2012 1:31:51 PM ET
Common sense can pay big dividends. If we could expand this motif to standardize other AF programs across the board we'd see large reductions in O and M spending across the board. Interesignly enough a mass reduction in unwarranted spending would allow us to keep more jobs. Start keeping tabs on who have unplanned funds at the end the of 3rd quarter every FY and make cuts as needed.

AD, VA

4/16/2012 1:31:00 PM ET
Now if we can just get Pilots to stop wearing the bag on days they are not scheduled to fly then perhaps the flight suits would last longer and in turn save tax payer too.

Jeff, Retired CT

4/16/2012 1:14:48 PM ET
Collision avoided sir...

Retired, Texas

4/16/2012 12:47:21 PM ET
Long overdue.

DC, MD

4/16/2012 12:32:13 PM ET
As a former Space Command Operator I can only say it is about time. I never understood the leather jacket and the flight suit for space and missile operations. Of course I also don't understand the flight suit wings and leather jacket for individuals flying UAVs.

Jerry, Oklahoma

4/16/2012 12:11:09 PM ET
I applaud the move but wonder why it doesn't take effect until the end of the FY. Enlisted members receive an allowance for this. Sounds familiar to when Chief of Staff directed blues wear on Mondays. There was a mass rush on clothing sales worldwide to comply. Once again I applaud the move as that is a commander trying to be accountable for how his command spends money. Now if the RPA operator would take notice.

ABU Wearer, Keesler AFB

4/16/2012 12:02:11 PM ET
Well done. But will AFGSC follow suit for its missileers or will other MAJCOMs with non-rated in flight suits Now let the mad onslaught for ABUs at Military Clothing Sales begin.

CP, Colo Spgs CO

4/16/2012 11:59:35 AM ET
The flight suit is probably the only uniform Airmen wear that actually reflects AF heritage. I'm an exclusive ABU wearer and I can't understand why people get upset over non-flyers wearing bags. Granted we all hate the ABU but that doesn't mean everyone has to be miserable in it. You want to wear a bag cross-train

JT, AK

4/16/2012 11:47:54 AM ET
Common sense is returning to the USAF I spent two years at Schriever and never ever understood why people were allowed to wear a flight suit when the only thing they flew was a desk

Retired, Arizona

4/16/2012 11:25:36 AM ET
Good

Retired, VA

4/16/2012 11:19:15 AM ET
If you are not flying you should be wearing the uniform of the day. About time.

DJF, Vance

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